BBS NA Secret Boss Theory [and possibly a whole new outlook to BBS's Secret Ending]

[Vanitas]

Alright, well many of you dont know me, in fact I think none of you know me, but you can just call me Vanitas and I think that I have a pretty reasonable theory in my head. Now as we all know, the NA Secret Boss wears a black coat extremely similar to the Organization XIII coat. He has blue lightsaber-type weapons, similar to the Aerial Blades that Xemnas uses. Alot of people here are thinking "Oh JEeZ i ThiNk XeMnas Time TrAVeleD." But I honestly doubt that he would do that. Plus just because Xemnas and this boss have similar type weapons, it doesnt mean that they're the same person. However, I do think that this has a little bit of time travel involved here.

Now lets look at the recent Degenki Scan with the Nomura Interview. He stated, "A new mysterious enemy has been added. It's terribly strong, so winning is an achievement. You meet it twice, and Debacker had to try twenty times before defeating it once." Hmm, pretty interesting. Another thing the interview stated was

Q: Is the new character also involved with the story?
N: As with the Lingering Sentiment, at the time of KHBBS I can't reveal that.

We also have heard that this boss is canon in a similar way as the Lingering Sentiment. Well lets take a look at two of the things we know about LS.

1. He is featured in the Secret Ending of the game he was in.
2. He is not in the time that he was originally in.

Well, is there anybody we know in BBS that meet the description of these two facts? Well I know somebody who meets one of the two, Ansem the Wise.

Now before you start trollin, hear me out. Ansem the Wise is in the secret ending, fitting the description of two things I have said. If he is the secret boss, than he would have been met twice in the game. Also, he would have fit one of the similarities of LS, both in secret ending.

But what about the 2nd similarity with LS?

This is where my theory starts becoming a little 'unstable' I guess. But again, dont start going 'NO PROOF! NO PROOF!" because half of the theories on this website dont have proof. Now what I think is that at the end of KH2, when Ansem's machine explodes, he was sent back in time. Perhaps he planned this? Maybe all along, he planned for the machine to blow up, so it would slow down the creation of Kingdom Hearts and so he would be sent back in time to stop the creation of Terranort, meaning no Xehanort/Terranort/AnsemSoD/Xemnas, stopping the creation of Heartless all together. However he knew that he couldnt be seen by his past self, so he wore the Organization Robe. So when he was in Land of Departure, TAV saw him (unless it takes place in Last Episdode, then only Aqua sees him) and thinks hes a little suspicious looking. So then a fight starts, and if the player wins, he fades into darkness, and gets sent to the RoD.


A couple reasons I think this happens is because

1. Aqua looks the same she did when she first fell into the RoD.
2. If this did take place after KH2, why didnt Sora or Riku see ATW? It looks like ATW was sitting there for a while, so was he just invisible when they appeared? Clearly not.
3. In the secret ending, ATW says that he's been to the RoD 3 times. First visit could have been when Radiant Garden was swallowed by darkness, then he found his way out as DiZ. Second time would be the time warp. If he went back all those years, he would still be in the Realm of Inbetween since TWTNW is in the RoIB. Just like Sora and Riku found a path from RoIB -> RoD -> RoL, I think ATW could do the same. Third visit would be when he is defeated.

I dont think the meeting between the two in the Secret Ending would be like 10 minutes after Aqua fell into the RoD, but I also dont think it took place after KH2. It wasnt right after BBS since Aqua says she has been traveling for a really long time. Also, ANsem says he is losing his memories. Put together his old age and being their longer than Aqua, honestly I dont blame him for losing his memories. If it took place right after KH2, I wouldnt really expect him to be losing memories, neither would I expect him to lose it right after BBS. So I think it is maybe a little under a year after BBS when they met. But it could be any time inbetween the two games.

Maybe when you beat the secret boss, a cutscene appears when he falls in a similar way Roxas did in the Sora v Roxas fight in KH2, where he had is hood fall down. After that, Ansem could warn her about the things to come, and after they all happen, she realizes that he wasnt evil, being the reason that the two didnt fight in the RoD.

And thats the end of my long long LONG theory :] Maybe you have to beat the secret boss to unlock the secret ending, or maybe you wont, but to kind of get a better idea of the secret ending you would have to unlock a cutscene after you beat the boss... and well, thats all I got :]

Tell me what you think :]

 

[Chris211]

I personally like to think its Ansem myself...where else did Xemnas learn to wield his weapons? But I don't think you actually have to explain the fighting itself...the fight doesn't have to be canon but at least that gives an explanation. Though I'm pretty sure someone actually gave examples of the 3 times he's been to the RoD before this supposed "time travel" and where did it say you meet it twice?

 

[Silverslide]

Answer these please.
1. Why would he attack Aqua?
2. Why is he in land of departure?
3. How did he even get there o.o

 

[Vanitas]

Where did it say you meet it twice?

Q:The North American version of BBS is to be released soon?
Nomura: Yes, it will be released Sept 7. Even though we've added many things, the story has changed little. Mark Hamill will be voicing Master Eraqus, And the voice of Master Xehanort is Leonard Nimoy. -ramble about Star Trek that makes NO BLOODY SENSE- A new mysterious enemy has been added. It's terribly strong, so winning is an achievement. You meet it twice, and Debacker had to try twenty times before defeating it once.

Hmm, If that's true about the example of Ansems trips to the RoD, then that might have just torn apart my whole theory. But hey, you never know, it could be anybody else's theory on this board.

Answer these please.
1. Why would he attack Aqua?
2. Why is he in land of departure?
3. How did he even get there o.o

1. Aqua could have felt provoked by him, summoned her keyblade, and ATW feeling like he needed to protect himself summoned some weapons that nobody ever knew he had.
2. Look at 3
2. Good point, perhaps instead of going to the RoD when he first warped in time, he stopped at Mysterious Tower. I dont think that twTNW was exactly the same as we see it now, and every Kingdom Hearts game the worlds are rearranged, so maybe there was some way to get from TWTNW to Mysterious Tower, keeping in mind that it's in the RoIB next to Twilight Town. So he meets Mickey, explains his journey and Mickey gives him the Gummi Rock / Shooting Star thing he has to go to the Land of Departure, also in the RoIB since it becomes CO and CO is in the RoIB (<- thats a mouthful xD)

 

[Chris211]

Answer these please.
1. Why would he attack Aqua?
2. Why is he in land of departure?
3. How did he even get there o.o

1. Who knows, the fight doesn't have to canon like I said
2. Who knows again...does the place have to matter?
3. Lol Once again, who knows, if the place doesnt have to matter than how it got there doesn't either. This is all speculation though, theres no telling with secret bosses.

@ Vanitas, ah sorry I read the old translation and just missed reading that part. I can't remember the 3 times he was in the RoD either..Someone said it though I believe.

 

[Silverslide]

1. Aqua could have felt provoked by him, summoned her keyblade, and ATW feeling like he needed to protect himself summoned some weapons that nobody ever knew he had.
2. Look at 3
2. Good point, perhaps instead of going to the RoD when he first warped in time, he stopped at Mysterious Tower. I dont think that twTNW was exactly the same as we see it now, and every Kingdom Hearts game the worlds are rearranged, so maybe there was some way to get from TWTNW to Mysterious Tower, keeping in mind that it's in the RoIB next to Twilight Town. So he meets Mickey, explains his journey and Mickey gives him the Gummi Rock / Shooting Star thing he has to go to the Land of Departure, also in the RoIB since it becomes CO and CO is in the RoIB (<- thats a mouthful xD)

1. Nope. Watch the trailer. The cloaked man summoned his weapons first. So this man, whoever he is, knew Aqua or had motive to attack her.
2. That is too convenient. Besides by this time Land of Departure is destroyed and the place we see this cloaked man isn't the same Land of Departure we see in during BBS. The sky is black and LoD should be castle oblivion.

 

[Allister Rose]

i'm sorry but this didni't make any sense to me.......why would ansem the wise wield similar weapoions of Xemnas?

i was starting to think from the flow of the theory that, just like realm of darkness's time didn't flowl ike realm of light. xemnas probably made it in there when he left that place after meeting with roxas

 

[Absolute]

1. If this did take place after KH2, why didnt Sora or Riku see ATW? It looks like ATW was sitting there for a while, so was he just invisible when they appeared? Clearly not.

If I remember correctly, Sora and Riku were looking into the realm of darkness from the side of the Realm of Nothing. ATW and Aqua reached the edge of the Realm of Darkness. The two shores could just look exactly the same, but two different places.

1. In the secret ending, ATW says that he's been to the RoD 3 times. First visit could have been when Radiant Garden was swallowed by darkness, then he found his way out as DiZ. Second time would be the time warp. If he went back all those years, he would still be in the Realm of Inbetween since TWTNW is in the RoIB. Just like Sora and Riku found a path from RoIB -> RoD -> RoL, I think ATW could do the same. Third visit would be when he is defeated.

In all honesty, I really hope time travel isn;t a part of the story. Its confusing enough as is.

Didn't ATW have the darkness-tainted eyes in BBS? If so, wouldn;t that mean that he went to the realm of darkness before the ending of BBS?

 

[Vanitas]

1. Nope. Watch the trailer. The cloaked man summoned his weapons first. So this man, whoever he is, knew Aqua or had motive to attack her.
2. That is too convenient. Besides by this time Land of Departure is destroyed and the place we see this cloaked man isn't the same Land of Departure we see in during BBS. The sky is black and LoD should be castle oblivion.

good point... i guess that knocks out the theory of Last Episode. but what if perhaps this was a situation like Sephiroth in KH2, where you meet him about halfway through the game and you can choose to battle him any time throughout the game? so maybe ATW got there before TAV started chasing after MX, and caught Mickey before everything happened? or maybe he didnt even need to go to Mysterious Tower. instead, since they are all in the same realm, maybe he went from TWTNW to LoD somehow? im not sure about this, but I think DiZ could create portals in KH2, or it might have been Rikunort...

i'm sorry but this didni't make any sense to me.......why would ansem the wise wield similar weapoions of Xemnas?

i was starting to think from the flow of the theory that, just like realm of darkness's time didn't flowl ike realm of light. xemnas probably made it in there when he left that place after meeting with roxas

you mean like time flows backwards rather than forwards? that would be a good theory, but at the end of KH2 when Sora and Riku get stranded after they are too late for the portal, everyone else is there for i dont know, maybe a couple hours before S and R are sent to Realm of Darkness. if time flowed backwards in RoD, im pretty sure that when the Door To Light opened, they would have reached Destin Islands before or at about the same time as everybody else.
and about the weapons, Terranort lost all of his memories when ATW found him, how do you think he learned how to fight as well as the leader of Organization XIII does? maybe Ansem has extreme skills and either gave some of the blades to Xehanort or Xehanort made it himself. so if we found out that the secret boss is ATW, then the question we shoulkd be asking is "Why does Xemnas have similar weapons of ATW?" ;]

1. If this did take place after KH2, why didnt Sora or Riku see ATW? It looks like ATW was sitting there for a while, so was he just invisible when they appeared? Clearly not.

If I remember correctly, Sora and Riku were looking into the realm of darkness from the side of the Realm of Nothing. ATW and Aqua reached the edge of the Realm of Darkness. The two shores could just look exactly the same, but two different places.

1. In the secret ending, ATW says that he's been to the RoD 3 times. First visit could have been when Radiant Garden was swallowed by darkness, then he found his way out as DiZ. Second time would be the time warp. If he went back all those years, he would still be in the Realm of Inbetween since TWTNW is in the RoIB. Just like Sora and Riku found a path from RoIB -> RoD -> RoL, I think ATW could do the same. Third visit would be when he is defeated.

In all honesty, I really hope time travel isn;t a part of the story. Its confusing enough as is.

Didn't ATW have the darkness-tainted eyes in BBS? If so, wouldn;t that mean that he went to the realm of darkness before the ending of BBS?

1. Good Point, never thought of that.
2. he had orange eyes, not yellow eyes. If he was tainted by darkness, he would be Silver Hair and Yellow Eyes.

 

[Silverslide]

good point... i guess that knocks out the theory of Last Episode. but what if perhaps this was a situation like Sephiroth in KH2, where you meet him about halfway through the game and you can choose to battle him any time throughout the game? so maybe ATW got there before TAV started chasing after MX, and caught Mickey before everything happened? or maybe he didnt even need to go to Mysterious Tower. instead, since they are all in the same realm, maybe he went from TWTNW to LoD somehow? im not sure about this, but I think DiZ could create portals in KH2, or it might have been Rikunort...

Still can't be this son. Look at the clouds behind the cloaked guy. They are pitch black, homie. The sky didn't look like that before. So this means that MX has already overtaken it with darkness. SO we probably fight this guy after finishing the game.

 

[Allister Rose]

you mean like time flows backwards rather than forwards? that would be a good theory, but at the end of KH2 when Sora and Riku get stranded after they are too late for the portal, everyone else is there for i dont know, maybe a couple hours before S and R are sent to Realm of Darkness. if time flowed backwards in RoD, im pretty sure that when the Door To Light opened, they would have reached Destin Islands before or at about the same time as everybody else.

No, not that it flowed backwards only. but the time doesn't flow properly. like in pandora hearts, there is no time at all in the world called the abyss, so they can enter at any random time.

 

[Vanitas]

Still can't be this son. Look at the clouds behind the cloaked guy. They are pitch black, homie. The sky didn't look like that before. So this means that MX has already overtaken it with darkness. SO we probably fight this guy after finishing the game.

ohh, i must have interpreted your post opposite of what you were saying. well, that really doesnt change anything then, but it doesnt look like the darkness covered LoD. even if it was after MX destroyed it, it wouldnt change anything in my theory. it would just be in the Last Episode. im pretty sure Mickey was at MT during Last episode, but again i could be wrong about this whole thing and it could be Ienzo in a big robot xD

 

[Absolute]

Crazy idea incoming: LoD should be destroyed and yet they fight in it. Castle obvlion in CoM could take a white room and form it based on an area in your memories. So, what if after Aqua made CO, she went back into it for some reason, and found this guy and then the white room they are in turns into LoD based on their memories?

Didn't Nomura say that something was created when MX placed his heart into Terra? Well, what happens if that something was then born in the remnants of LoD and then got trapped inside when Aqua made it into CO?

 

[Allister Rose]

Crazy idea incoming: LoD should be destroyed and yet they fight in it. Castle obvlion in CoM could take a white room and form it based on an area in your memories. So, what if after Aqua made CO, she went back into it for some reason, and found this guy and then the white room they are in turns into LoD based on their memories?

Didn't Nomura say that something was created when MX placed his heart into Terra? Well, what happens if that something was then born in the remnants of LoD and then got trapped inside when Aqua made it into CO?

it wasn't completely destroyed. As seen in last episode. aqua was able to still enter there. i was thinking that since terra's heart gave into darkness when MX entered his body. that would mean that master eraqus gained a nobody. but then again, nobodies using cloaks wasn't a norm yet

 

[Vanitas]

Crazy idea incoming: LoD should be destroyed and yet they fight in it. Castle obvlion in CoM could take a white room and form it based on an area in your memories. So, what if after Aqua made CO, she went back into it for some reason, and found this guy and then the white room they are in turns into LoD based on their memories?

Didn't Nomura say that something was created when MX placed his heart into Terra? Well, what happens if that something was then born in the remnants of LoD and then got trapped inside when Aqua made it into CO?

I highly doubt it. The way that the Worlds inside CO work was because of Namine. She took Sora's memories and made them into worlds after she was born and Xemnas scanned Sora in KH1.

 

[Absolute]

Oh. Well, there's goes my theory. Also, strange has Namine was born in CO instead of say Twilight Town.

 

[Fractured_Heart628]

I think it might be Master Xehanort or Apprentice Xehanort for some reason.

 

[Chris211]

it wasn't completely destroyed. As seen in last episode. aqua was able to still enter there. i was thinking that since terra's heart gave into darkness when MX entered his body. that would mean that master eraqus gained a nobody. but then again, nobodies using cloaks wasn't a norm yet

Terra's heart didn't give in when MX entered his body necessarily...if he gave in then I doubt he would've put up a resistance to MX's control...and regardless that doesnt mean ME would've produced a nobody.

 

[Relix]

If this guy were Ansme he'd be on par with Aqua's fighting skills and Terra's fighting skills and be able to hold his own against Xemnas...Ansem had no type of fighting skills what so ever in KH2 and was being rushed by dusks. Instead of getting Sora to take his revenge for him or asking Riku to retrieve Roxas why couldn't he do it himself with his crazy skills that this theory claims he has. I do however find it strange as to why Ansem gained a black coat but according to Nomura the scene with Aqua and Ansem takes place right after KH2 because Nomura was disclaiming that it happened a year after KH2 but rather just right after it so Ansem would have to find a way back to the future in order to make this conversation and according to the secret ending Aqua doesn't know Ansem. She doesn't even attack him, or feels any hostility. And I think you'd remember someone in a black coat who tried to kill you and wouldn't casually walk up to them and ask them who they were. This guy just screams Xehanort to me but I think its too obvious to just be another incarnation. But bottom line I say that there is really nothing pointing it to being Ansem, and many things pointing to it not being him.

Nomura saying Ansem was blown to the realm of darkness not into the past. unless you wish to think that he was blown into the past into the realm of darkness.

Q16: What happened to Ansem the Wise?
A: He is wandering in the realm of darkness.

Ansem the Wise, who banished to the realm of nothingness by his six apprentices. In KHII, he wanted to release the Kingdom Hearts made from people’s hearts that the Nobodies of his apprentices had created. The machine that he used for that end exploded, taking him with it. It looked as though he disappeared, but we know from the secret event in BbS that he was sent into the realm of darkness.

Something else that caught my attention

(?) What happened to his heart and memories after separation?

One year after BbS, Apprentice Xehanort was separated into his Heartless (Ansem Seeker of Darkness) and his Nobody (Xemnas). The former took actions that were more like Master Xehanort, while the latter has said things that seem more like Terra, so how were Terra and Master Xehanort’s hearts and wills separated, and what sort of influences do they have over each?

[picture: Organization member (don’t remember who said this, Xigbar?)]

It is also a mystery that he would know about the room where Ventus sleeps, which should only be known to Aqua.

The bold part in particular and then in the NA version of BBS they just happen to show us a guy similar to Xemnas encountering Aqua where Ven's temporary resting place is or is to be. A place where Xemnas somehow knew hid Ven.

 

[Sign]

There's that FM cutscene where Xigbar speaks with Zexion about how he once eavesdropped on Xemnas in the Chamber of Repose speaking with someone, so that seems to be hinting towards a possible lingering sentiment in Aqua's armor telling him all these things.