Am I the only one that thinks yozora is gonna be a series mainstay?



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Hello, this is something that always seems to interest me. Riku(we don't know yet) somehow entering a new world in search of sora. The reason I think so is yozora seems interested in riku. Like who is this man he never seen before? I don't have a theory yet to support this, but to me it does look like yozora is gonna important to kingdom hearts return of the foretellers saga. I don't know how, but it's a gut feeling i'm having. We could get a bunch of character development since his probably from a different worldline, and could possibly help riku find sora. Heck maybe even making a new trio (sora, riku, and yozora).

Please tell me what you think. I do think this opens up a lot of possibilities for storytelling.
 

Twilight Lumiair

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Not shutting anything down, but I just wanna say that I always saw Yozora's appearance in the Secret Ending as 100% conceptual/non-committal, meaning he'll likely not be included in the capacity that we saw him. The Secret Endings all have something like that right? Roxas' golden eyes, him wielding Kingdom Key D (while Mickey weilds the kk), the falling meteorites, and a beta design of KH2 Kairi. TAV finding Sora, Riku, and Mickey's Keyblades, their capes, Ventus' Keyblade being broken due to being Frozen and hit by the side of the cliff, Terra's yellow eye change in the manor that we saw it, etc.

Compared to either of those, there's significantly less going on in this secret ending (which is part of why it lacks my interest so much), and I honestly can't find anything else but Yozora that could realistically not be included in the actual scene. Never mind the fact that he was a video game character in the Toy Box, and they likely just pulled his model to use in that on shot there. I mean without him, how much left can you really say is in the secret ending? They might have even simply been trying to fill in time, who knows. I just never once saw it as anything to really pay attention to personally. That said, if fans continue to fixate on his appearance with enough interest, that could be what prompts the developers to include him in future projects if they haven't decided on that already. Still, to me, it just seems like one of those things Nomura included because it was "cool", and because of he was still sore over FFXV.
 

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Considering the secret ending is named after him I think it's safe to assume that he will be a major player for at least the next game. And possibly for the rest of the next Saga if he is representing the white chess piece like I'm predicting.
 

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Considering the secret ending is named after him I think it's safe to assume that he will be a major player for at least the next game. And possibly for the rest of the next Saga if he is representing the white chess piece like I'm predicting.
Hmmm, but isn't that peice basically confirmed to be Sora? We already saw that it was the crown peice, and Sora's been confirmed to stay the main protagonist going into the future, so it makes sense that that particular cutscene was trying to tell us he's the common factor. If not, what symbol would Sora be represented by? Would he have a peice at all? I can't think of one off the top of my head. 🤔
 

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It would be really cool if Yozora was the main character in the next game. They could give KH a new tone with him
 

Zettaflare

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Hmmm, but isn't that peice basically confirmed to be Sora? We already saw that it was the crown peice, and Sora's been confirmed to stay the main protagonist going into the future, so it makes sense that that particular cutscene was trying to tell us he's the common factor. If not, what symbol would Sora be represented by? Would he have a peice at all? I can't think of one off the top of my head. 🤔
When asked if the white piece was Sora's Nomura replied with "Well, maybe". While not outright deconfirming Sora he did leave some room for speculation
 

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Not shutting anything down, but I just wanna say that I always saw Yozora's appearance in the Secret Ending as 100% conceptual/non-committal, meaning he'll likely not be included in the capacity that we saw him. The Secret Endings all have something like that right? Roxas' golden eyes, him wielding Kingdom Key D (while Mickey weilds the kk), the falling meteorites, and a beta design of KH2 Kairi. TAV finding Sora, Riku, and Mickey's Keyblades, their capes, Ventus' Keyblade being broken due to being Frozen and hit by the side of the cliff, Terra's yellow eye change in the manor that we saw it, etc.
In your examples, all the characters remain in the final versions (well except mickey). And what do you mean in the capacity that we saw him, as in character design? Cause he didn't do anything in the secret ending lol.
I honestly can't find anything else but Yozora that could realistically not be included in the actual scene
I think that would be such a jarring difference to completely remove him from the scene, considering he's like the only new character. But again idk if you mean re doing his character design when you say removing him from the scene.

Compared to either of those, there's significantly less going on in this secret ending (which is part of why it lacks my interest so much)
Well you did include the fm secret endings, which weren't included in the original english games.
(pls have an extended secret ending for dlc pls)
 

Twilight Lumiair

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In your examples, all the characters remain in the final versions (well except mickey). And what do you mean in the capacity that we saw him, as in character design? Cause he didn't do anything in the secret ending lol.

I think that would be such a jarring difference to completely remove him from the scene, considering he's like the only new character. But again idk if you mean re doing his character design when you say removing him from the scene.
I mean he may be in a future a game, just not in the way that we saw. In other words he wouldn't be there sitting atop a building watching Sora & Riku, he'd likely be there in some other way (like a secret boss, or some kind of cloud-esc sub-plot). Or maybe he won't be present at all. All the examples I listed were elements cut in the final versions of the scenes, and unlike the new characters there (which I didn't list actually), Yozora doesn't really do or add anything to the sequence. My point was I personally doubt he'll be a central player in the main story like many take his shot to mean. I just don't anything of substance about it.

Yes, that's exactly my point, lol. He does absolutely nothing in the secret ending, so how hard would it honestly be to picture the scene without him there considering this fact? Sora and Riku don't interact with him. He doesn't move or say anything. Is it really so silly to consider the possibility that they simply placed him there to fill in time because they didn't have that much prepared to show? Reusing assets, to put it another way. They did get quite behind in terms of development time, it's possible this was all they could really manage (the entire Anti-Aqua subplot, for example, was made using repurposed assets from 0.2). That, and Nomura said his visions for the future were a "blank slate," so maybe he just didn't wanna tie himself down with too many ideas, idk.

Real quick, doesn't Yozora translate to night sky? One of the most prominent things about this secret ending is that it takes place in a night time cityscape, so perhaps Yozora is there to add further symbolism? Just food for thought.
 

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I mean he may be in a future a game, just not in the way that we saw. In other words he wouldn't be there sitting atop a building watching Sora & Riku, he'd likely be there in some other way (like a secret boss, or some kind of cloud-esc sub-plot). Or maybe he won't be present at all. All the examples I listed were elements cut in the final versions of the scenes, and unlike the new characters there (which I didn't list actually), Yozora doesn't really do or add anything to the sequence. My point was I personally doubt he'll be a central player in the main story like many take his shot to mean. I just don't anything of substance about it.

Yes, that's exactly my point, lol. He does absolutely nothing in the secret ending, so how hard would it honestly be to picture the scene without him there considering this fact? Sora and Riku don't interact with him. He doesn't move or say anything. Is it really so silly to consider the possibility that they simply placed him there to fill in time because they didn't have that much prepared to show? Reusing assets, to put it another way. They did get quite behind in terms of development time, it's possible this was all they could really manage (the entire Anti-Aqua subplot, for example, was made using repurposed assets from 0.2). That, and Nomura said his visions for the future were a "blank slate," so maybe he just didn't wanna tie himself down with too many ideas, idk.

Real quick, doesn't Yozora translate to night sky? One of the most prominent things about this secret ending is that it takes place in a night time cityscape, so perhaps Yozora is there to add further symbolism? Just food for thought.
You seem pretty quick to dismiss Yozora having any prominince next game for some reason
 

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I'm fairly certain the prevalence of Yozora in Toy Box + the secret ending is proof enough that Nomura has a clear plan in mind for him and it isn't just some conceptual thing he made up on a whim.
 

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You seem pretty quick to dismiss Yozora having any prominince next game for some reason
I didn't dismiss.. anything? I just stated that I don't think that will be the case, and clarified my reasons why since he was asking about them. If someone has a theory, I may disagree, but I can't exactly dismiss it. I can only give my perspective. And from what I saw, his appearance doesn't really seem to mean all that much.
 
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Zettaflare

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I didn't dismiss.. anything? I just stated that I don't think that will be the case, and clarified my reasons why since he was asking about them. If someone has a theory, I may disagree, but I can't exactly dismiss it. I can only give my perspective. And from what I saw, his appearance doesn't really seem to mean all that much.
It's just odd you claim that Yozora's appearance in the secret ending doesn't mean much when.
1.the secret ending is named after him
2. Riku is in the Verum Rex city.

If Nomura is going to use the next Saga(or at least the next game) to explore the abandoned concepts of Versus would it not make sense to use his version of Noctis?
 

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It's just odd you claim that Yozora's appearance in the secret ending doesn't mean much when.
1.the secret ending is named after him
2. Riku is in the Verum Rex city.

If Nomura is going to use the next Saga(or at least the next game) to explore the abandoned concepts of Versus would it not make sense to use his version of Noctis?
Initially I did, but after looking back at Verum Rex, and what's it's supposed to represent, I feel like having specifically Yozora (who's already a parody of Noctis) be his actual stand-in for Noctis, might be a bit too... on the nose, even for Nomura. That said, I could definitely see Yozora's presence being there to at least symbolize that he'll be delving into Versus 13 concepts if nothing else. Perhaps you have some ideas on how that could potentially play out within the context of Kingdom Hearts? I haven't brushed up on my v13 knowledge in quite a while, so I can't say I personally have any ideas toward where those concepts might go.
 
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Face My Fears

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I hope not (unless he's going to be the villain). I just want the series to use who we've got. It would be an injustice to give Yozora tons of time when other characters sorely need it.
 

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I hope not (unless he's going to be the villain). I just want the series to use who we've got. It would be an injustice to give Yozora tons of time when other characters sorely need it.
Agreed. I don't mind Yozora having an important role but I don't want him to overshadow the rest of the characters. We need to build on them instead of focusing too much on a character thats just a Riku reskin at this point. And that sounds harsh on my end because the secret ending is one of the many things I disliked about KH3; espeically after reading the secret reports, I was even more upset and wesry for the future arc of this story.

I know Its too early to judge but Yozora as a concept and a character right now just screams Noruma having some of his priorities screwed about this narrative with adding concepts from FFv13 and obvious favoritism for Riku , which was already kind of a problem in the last arc. Plus, its bad enough that we have other two characters running around that look exactly like each other and its never addressed in any meaningful way but now he wants to add another one? I know its something that's obviously tied to the Worldlines concept being introduced but again, speaking of that concept, all of it just feels.. unnecessary. Like, whats the point of adding of this to the narrative when this universe already has so much other stuff going on that we can further explore and grow on like The Final World, Sleeping Realm (something that really needs way more explaination), twilight realm, Realm of darkness, the location of other keyblade wielders, who the MoM is and his role in everything and a bunch of orher stuff. So why on top of that do we need to add something like Worldlines, which is basically the KH version of the multiverse, right now? Obviously we'll get those answers but even if we do, I still feel like I'm gonna feel the exact same way as I do now.

Especially when I read up on the Sleeping Realm thoery, which was cool to read and I guess explain some things but a lot of felt somewhat bias as far as how they interprated character interactions but also how they explain how Sora got back and how its tied into Worldlines, all of it felt like way too much and none of feels like it has a point another then to say, "If Noruma wants to wipe the slate clean with the series with new characters or a reboot, he can do that now" and I'm just like, "who cares? As far this story and its narrative timeline, its a little to early to being introducing fans to something like this when you haven't even built on the things you have right now. "

Like, I get the missing girl thing, Sora and Riku playing the Reaper's game, the gap in Ventus' past, and Luxu coming back the way he did with the foretellers. All of it feels organic to whats going to potentially happen next. All of it relates back to KH X, which is an important apart of the lore and none of it really boggs the story down, it moves it forward.

But the Worldlines and Yozora... Like, whats the point? Why would you need to add this concept and this character anyway? I guess you could say the same thing with the Missing girl but its not the same thing because it fills in the gap of why Saix and Lea wanted to overthrow the Organization and she is possibly a foreteller. Yes, its adding something that wasn't there and probably didn't need to be there but at least it feels like an oraganic part of the story with the foreteller arc and tied to characyers we're invested in. They give you reasons to care about it and theorize.

What point does Worldlines and Yozora serve with the narrative of the foretellers, an arc thats already dealing with the complex concepts of time travel, seperate realms and dimensions; the worldlines and Yozora just feels like its adding more unto a story that already has enough meat in its bones, meat thats already hard to chew for some fans, so why add more?

Because Noruma is butthurt about FFv13? Because that's really all it feels like, an excuse to add conceptual ideas from a completely different story unto another story that already has a lot going on in its own universe that needs to built upon that foundation instead of adding more stuff.

I have hope Noruma can streamline it well because its not like the secret endings are always 100% defintive but it all just seems like a recipe for disastrous storytelling but I guess that isn't really new for KH.
 
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Face My Fears

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Agreed. I don't mind Yozora having an important role but I don't want him to overshadow the rest of the characters. We need to build on them instead of focusing too much on a character thats just a Riku reskin at this point. And that sounds harsh on my end because the secret ending is one of the many things I disliked about KH3; espeically after reading the secret reports, I was even more upset and wesry for the future arc of this story.

I know Its too early to judge but Yozora as a concept and a character right now just screams Noruma having some of his priorities screwed about this narrative with adding concepts from FFv13 and obvious favoritism for Riku , which was already kind of a problem in the last arc. Plus, its bad enough that we have other two characters running around that look exactly like each other and its never addressed in any meaningful way but now he wants to add another one? I know its something that's obviously tied to the Worldlines concept being introduced but again, speaking of that concept, all of it just feels.. unnecessary. Like, whats the point of adding of this to the narrative when this universe already has so much other stuff going on that we can further explore and grow on like The Final World, Sleeping Realm (something that really needs way more explaination), twilight realm, Realm of darkness, the location of other keyblade wielders, who the MoM is and his role in everything and a bunch of orher stuff. So why on top of that do we need to add something like Worldlines, which is basically the KH version of the multiverse, right now? Obviously we'll get those answers but even if we do, I still feel like I'm gonna feel the exact same way as I do now.

Especially when I read up on the Sleeping Realm thoery, which was cool to read and I guess explain some things but a lot of felt somewhat bias as far as how they interprated character interactions but also how they explain how Sora got back and how its tied into Worldlines, all of it felt like way too much and none of feels like it has a point another then to say, "If Noruma wants to wipe the slate clean with the series with new characters or a reboot, he can do that now" and I'm just like, "who cares? As far this story and its narrative timeline, its a little to early to being introducing fans to something like this when you haven't even built on the things you have right now. "

Like, I get the missing girl thing, Sora and Riku playing the Reaper's game, the gap in Ventus' past, and Luxu coming back the way he did with the foretellers. All of it feels organic to whats going to potentially happen next. All of it relates back to KH X, which is an important apart of the lore and none of it really boggs the story down, it moves it forward.

But the Worldlines and Yozora... Like, whats the point? Why would you need to add this concept and this character anyway? I guess you could say the same thing with the Missing girl but its not the same thing because it fills in the gap of why Saix and Lea wanted to overthrow the Organization and she is possibly a foreteller. Yes, its adding something that wasn't there and probably didn't need to be there but at least it feels like an oraganic part of the story with the foreteller arc and tied to characyers we're invested in. They give you reasons to care about it and theorize.

What point does Worldlines and Yozora serve with the narrative of the foretellers, an arc thats already dealing with the complex concepts of time travel, seperate realms and dimensions; the worldlines and Yozora just feels like its adding more unto a story that already has enough meat in its bones, meat thats already hard to chew for some fans, so why add more?

Because Noruma is butthurt about FFv13? Because that's really all it feels like, an excuse to add conceptual ideas from a completely different story unto another story that already has a lot going on in its own universe that needs to built upon that foundation instead of adding more stuff.

I have hope Noruma can streamline it well because its not like the secret endings are always 100% defintive but it all just seems like a recipe for disastrous storytelling but I guess that isn't really new for KH.
I'm hoping that Yozora is limited to a character used to help explain the Sleeping Realms/world lines better. If he is in the first world (Shibuya) and that's it, I'm fine with that. I liked the secret video because it gave us a lot to speculate about leading up to the next game, so it reminds me of beating KH1 and having no idea where things were going. I just hope Yozora isn't Riku's "special nobody" who ended up in the Sleeping Realm/getting lost in the world lines.
 

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I'm hoping that Yozora is limited to a character used to help explain the Sleeping Realms/world lines better. If he is in the first world (Shibuya) and that's it, I'm fine with that. I liked the secret video because it gave us a lot to speculate about leading up to the next game, so it reminds me of beating KH1 and having no idea where things were going. I just hope Yozora isn't Riku's "special nobody" who ended up in the Sleeping Realm/getting lost in the world lines.
I feel the same way, which is why I'm board for KHx going to console to futher explore those ideas.

And yeah, I just don't like the idea of another Riku running around anyway but Yozora being Riku's nobody would be a conclusion I'd be kind of okay with but yeah, I'm not entirely sure I want that either because that would require a lot of explaining, especially of how his nobody ended up there and why Riku still has his body. So Yozora being Riku but from an alternate universe version of him makes more sense and makes the Worldlines feel less out of place but again, you would have to give clear thematic reason for it being intriduced in the first place? What does it add to the story other then saying "The multiverse exists" okay, it does. So what thematically does that have to do with anything going on right now? What does this mean for the story?

And thats really the main problem I have with it. Because if you take the multiverse theory out of this story and just focus on the Reapers game, I don't see how it would mess with any plotlines. There's really no reason for TWEWY to be in a seperate realm altogther. If thats the case, how did Sora even get there if its in a different reality? Why not just say that the world existed in the realm of light and ended up in a seperate pocket realm possibly because of the Reapers game, which would add more lore to The Final World the Starion of Awakening and how it all work? And who exactly is in charge of the Reapers game and why it exists? Why didn't Sora end up there before he ended up in The Final World? And its because of the wild card given to him by Luxord then how does Luxord even know about it?

Again, we'll get a clear picture once we explore those ideas in a future game but with everything else set up, I don't how taking it how messes with anything set up if you toke it out completely, which makes me believe that this whole concept is completely pointless.

The only way I see it adding anything is explaining how the foretellers got here in the first place, which is the what secret reports do say, at least somewhat. Because you can't say time travel because you can't travel to the future. But again, how does the multiverse thoery work with that framework exactly? How would that allow them to be able to be in our time since that still meses with the rules of time travel? Do Worldlines allow you pass by those rules and if so, how and why? And where do Sleeping realm tie into all of this?

To be fair, I may be missing a few details from the secret reports but its still confusing at this point in the narrative to digest. Even if they do explain it, I feel like its just going to muddy the narrative going forward.

Its the same problem I had with time travel. It really just didn't to be there at all but again, we'll see what happens. I'm a diehard to the end unless KH does something narratively incoherent and so far, its only done that with time travel but at least its explained and fits within the narrative and doesn't really contridict itself, no matter how dumb and unnecessary it was.

So we can only hope for the best right now.
*looks at kairi and cries*
 
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Because Noruma is butthurt about FFv13? Because that's really all it feels like, an excuse to add conceptual ideas from a completely different story unto another story that already has a lot going on in its own universe that needs to built upon that foundation instead of adding more stuff.
Firstly, Nomura has every right to be angry over the train wreck that is the Versus XIII/Final Fantasy XV debacle. It was in no way his fault that he and his team kept being pulled into other projects, only for Versus XIII to be taken away from him and altered heavily. If Nomura wants to add the concepts into something he knows he has control over, then he has every right to. Any problems KH suffers will be like it has been. Avoiding the plot at all costs, visiting irrelevant Disney worlds, bad excuses, and doing things for the heck of it without regards to context.

Secondly, we don't know if this is something he's thought of now or if he had actually planned on using Versus XIII in Kingdom Hearts. Maybe the change to FFXV screwed up what he wanted to do.

One thing we do know is it was still Versus during Dream Drop Distance's production, a game that contained the TWEWY cast. Which, as we know, will play a role going forward. If we go by their appearance in DDD meaning Nomura decided to use Shibuya and all it entails since then (Nomura is the type to focus more on what's ahead than what's in front of him) then he could have also planned to use another game of his involving the theme of death around that time.
 
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