Hi everybody,
First, I'd like to say that I've only recently finished KH 1.5, and I also played KH2 a few years ago, so please do not spoil me anything from BBS, Coded or 3D. Thanks.
Okay, I think I REALLY hate all the stuff (in CoM and Days) about "memories linked together, like they're in a chain" and Naminé's powers, that is " to take apart the links and rearrange them". Really.
I mean, I know they introduced all this in order to give a kind of explanation of how memories work in the KH's universe (instead of just saying "this is magic"), but I have the feeling that it just brings contradictions, plotholes or very confusing things.
I've done a little thinking, so here are the things that I do not quite manage to explain, and which seem to contradict each other. So if you have a clear explanation, I'd like to know it.
1) People that are forgotten by Sora in CoM also forgot Sora, in return. There is a quite simple explanation, which says that Sora's chain of memories is linked with those of the people he knows, and so what Naminé did while breaking his memories was actually taking apart the links between Sora's chain and the other characters' chains. And so they forgot Sora, as well as he did forget them.
Fine. I like this explanation, it makes sense.
But then here are the contradictions / confusing parts :
At the end of CoM, Naminé says that Sora'll have to forget everything about Castle Oblivion to get his old memories back (well, I could argue that if forgetting false memories of Naminé on the islands is completely consistent to get Kairi back, there is no such reason to forget the REAL memories of the things that happened at Castle Oblivion. Can't she just connect the memories of CO at the end of the chain ? That Sora remembers Naminé from CO but not from the islands ? Of course, one could also argue that the memories of CO were too much tangled with the false ones, but it just seems like an excuse for not Sora remembering anything at the start of KH2... whatever).
That way, Naminé takes apart the links of the chains of memories about all the events in CO, and Sora forgets about the Organization's members (Axel, for instance).
Then, according to what I say previously, how is it possible that Axel remembers Sora ?
Naminé breaks the chains of memories between Sora and Kairi in Sora's heart => Sora AND Kairi forget
(you can replace Kairi by any other relevant character)
Naminé breaks the chains of memories between Sora and Axel in Sora's heart => Sora forgets but Axel remembers
Why ? What is the difference, other than the obvious reason "Axel and Sora are not friends" which I'm not satisfied with ?
Still on the same subject, in 358/2 Days, when Naminé and Riku are talking about Xion :
"If I just jump in and rearrange her [Xion's] memories, Sora might wake up to find out nobody remembers him."
Again, what's she saying here ? According to the theory of chains of memories between people, how is it even possible that Sora remembers his friends, but not the other way around ?
How meddling with Xion's memories could allow Sora to remember, but not his friends ?
I shall sum up all these points like this : What is the explanation (related with all the "chains of memories" stuff) that makes some people forget everything about Sora while others keep their memories with him intact (Axel who remembers CO with Sora) ?
2) When Xion gives Sora's memories back to him and disappear, everyone forgets her. The only "explanation" we get is a sentence from Naminé, again : "In exchange for not having your own memory, you're connected through other's memories. So, when you disappear,.....".
This is quite unclear. This just does not make sense, Everyone is connected through other's memories (see my first point), it isn't just her.
What I understand from the game, however, is that Xion's entire identity and personality were due to Sora's memories of Kairi. She does not have a mind or a personality of her own. She is the personification of Sora's memories. So when she disappears, and gives Sora his memories back, she also takes the memories with Axel and Roxas. It is like the memories with Axel and Roxas becomes Sora's memories (see the end of the game : "our memories will be, forever, inside Sora").
But then, here is my problem : why, in KH2, when Roxas merges into Sora, Axel still remembers his friend ? Isn't it exactly the the same situation than with Xion ? One could tell : "Yes, but here the links between the chains of memories of Axel and Roxas are still present in Sora's heart, they do not fall apart. So Axel remembers Roxas."
But why couldn't it be the same with Xion ? Her memories still being connected with Roxas and Axel, even inside Sora ?
Here it is, sorry for the long messages. It is just all of I can think today . I would gladly discuss all these matters with you.
I'm not an native English speaker, so sorry for the mistakes that you'll see.
First, I'd like to say that I've only recently finished KH 1.5, and I also played KH2 a few years ago, so please do not spoil me anything from BBS, Coded or 3D. Thanks.
Okay, I think I REALLY hate all the stuff (in CoM and Days) about "memories linked together, like they're in a chain" and Naminé's powers, that is " to take apart the links and rearrange them". Really.
I mean, I know they introduced all this in order to give a kind of explanation of how memories work in the KH's universe (instead of just saying "this is magic"), but I have the feeling that it just brings contradictions, plotholes or very confusing things.
I've done a little thinking, so here are the things that I do not quite manage to explain, and which seem to contradict each other. So if you have a clear explanation, I'd like to know it.
1) People that are forgotten by Sora in CoM also forgot Sora, in return. There is a quite simple explanation, which says that Sora's chain of memories is linked with those of the people he knows, and so what Naminé did while breaking his memories was actually taking apart the links between Sora's chain and the other characters' chains. And so they forgot Sora, as well as he did forget them.
Fine. I like this explanation, it makes sense.
But then here are the contradictions / confusing parts :
At the end of CoM, Naminé says that Sora'll have to forget everything about Castle Oblivion to get his old memories back (well, I could argue that if forgetting false memories of Naminé on the islands is completely consistent to get Kairi back, there is no such reason to forget the REAL memories of the things that happened at Castle Oblivion. Can't she just connect the memories of CO at the end of the chain ? That Sora remembers Naminé from CO but not from the islands ? Of course, one could also argue that the memories of CO were too much tangled with the false ones, but it just seems like an excuse for not Sora remembering anything at the start of KH2... whatever).
That way, Naminé takes apart the links of the chains of memories about all the events in CO, and Sora forgets about the Organization's members (Axel, for instance).
Then, according to what I say previously, how is it possible that Axel remembers Sora ?
Naminé breaks the chains of memories between Sora and Kairi in Sora's heart => Sora AND Kairi forget
(you can replace Kairi by any other relevant character)
Naminé breaks the chains of memories between Sora and Axel in Sora's heart => Sora forgets but Axel remembers
Why ? What is the difference, other than the obvious reason "Axel and Sora are not friends" which I'm not satisfied with ?
Still on the same subject, in 358/2 Days, when Naminé and Riku are talking about Xion :
"If I just jump in and rearrange her [Xion's] memories, Sora might wake up to find out nobody remembers him."
Again, what's she saying here ? According to the theory of chains of memories between people, how is it even possible that Sora remembers his friends, but not the other way around ?
How meddling with Xion's memories could allow Sora to remember, but not his friends ?
I shall sum up all these points like this : What is the explanation (related with all the "chains of memories" stuff) that makes some people forget everything about Sora while others keep their memories with him intact (Axel who remembers CO with Sora) ?
2) When Xion gives Sora's memories back to him and disappear, everyone forgets her. The only "explanation" we get is a sentence from Naminé, again : "In exchange for not having your own memory, you're connected through other's memories. So, when you disappear,.....".
This is quite unclear. This just does not make sense, Everyone is connected through other's memories (see my first point), it isn't just her.
What I understand from the game, however, is that Xion's entire identity and personality were due to Sora's memories of Kairi. She does not have a mind or a personality of her own. She is the personification of Sora's memories. So when she disappears, and gives Sora his memories back, she also takes the memories with Axel and Roxas. It is like the memories with Axel and Roxas becomes Sora's memories (see the end of the game : "our memories will be, forever, inside Sora").
But then, here is my problem : why, in KH2, when Roxas merges into Sora, Axel still remembers his friend ? Isn't it exactly the the same situation than with Xion ? One could tell : "Yes, but here the links between the chains of memories of Axel and Roxas are still present in Sora's heart, they do not fall apart. So Axel remembers Roxas."
But why couldn't it be the same with Xion ? Her memories still being connected with Roxas and Axel, even inside Sora ?
Here it is, sorry for the long messages. It is just all of I can think today . I would gladly discuss all these matters with you.
I'm not an native English speaker, so sorry for the mistakes that you'll see.
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