• Hello everybody! We have tons of new awards for the new year that can be requested through our Awards System thanks to Antifa Lockhart! Some are limited-time awards so go claim them before they are gone forever...

    CLICK HERE FOR AWARDS

Some theories before the release of KH3D



REGISTER TO REMOVE ADS
Status
Not open for further replies.

Dawn Rebirth

New member
Joined
Sep 4, 2009
Messages
828
Location
Can you say vacay on Radiant Isle, and I'm growing
Intro

Hello KHI Forums, with KH3D only few days away, and possible leaked playthroughs or scenes from it being posted on the internet even sooner, I have finally come-up with my own theories towards MF. In the past I have done some very, very foolish theories having to do with KH. But, just like with Vanitas(Who people on this site had pegged for being a black-hair, gold-eyed Sora before the game was even released offically in Japan), I think I may have cracked this mystery before the game has even been released.

Still, I will say it remains a theory until the release of KH3D and until the contents of the game have been played through. In case you've seen this theory anywhere else, I haven't looked on other forums, and only breifly looked at the theories on this site. If this is the case, I appoligize in advance.

This also contains a seperate theory that accomadates one on MF. Just to warn you all ahead of time. Any quotes taken from the Ultimas, Reports, Interviews, etc are all thanks to KHInsider Staff, just so you and they know in advance.


MF(Part 1)


In an earlier interview by Numora this was revealed on the Unknown. Or as he is identified as a silver-hair teenager, with a darker shade of golden eyes than Vanitas, and a somewhat dark tan.



Famitsu: In Fantasia as well as other worlds, a golden eyed person wearing a black coat appears, who is he?
Nomura: He is the mysterious man who appeared in Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep Final Mix as a boss who manipulated time. Just who he is will be told in KH3D. Everywhere he goes, a few people of the darkness turn up, like how Vanitas came out in the trailer​


So we now know who MF is, but what kind person he is and what his origins are, are still up for debate. However, thanks to a recent scan translation it may just put all speculations to rest on who this person is.

Alongside them, Lea appears before Yen Sid. The dialogue on the screenshot says, "Maybe from a fairly early stage, Xehanort was probably suspected."

So, if it wasn't already obvious, MF is more than likely a younger Xehanort. But suspected, could be a short for saying "Xehanort was probably suspected of succumbed to the darkness in his heart" or something among those lines. For the sake of 'this' theory I'm going to assume that's what he meant. So yes, I believe he is MX's nobody, not to be confused with Xehanort's nobody.​

Now I'll explain how it is possible for both Xemnas and this entity to exist at once for those who don't quite understand. Xemnas is the nobody of Xehanort, Xehanort is really MX who has seized both Terra's Heart and Body. In doing this, he sacrificed his body and stabbed his heart, or rather unlocked it from his vessel using his Keyblade so he could take over Terra's heart and thus claim his body.​

So, MX could have produced a nobody prior to that event and thus that would be his nobody and therefore not Xehanort's, savvy? It's somewhat complicated, but it does make sense in KH universal rules. The fact that MX's nobody shares so many characteristics with Xemnas, even to the point of sharing the same type of weapon may indicate their connections as being in a sense the same person. In a way, one could say that MX's nobody is a younger version of Xemnas, and the opposite for vice-versa, but that's more interesting than significant.​

Place in Organization XIII

For sometime there have been numerous speculations on what MF was, for instance I (And if I'm not mistaken, some of you) previously speculated he could have been the next replica to take Xion's place that was briefly mentioned in a Days Report written by either Xemnas or Saix. The coat that he wears is usually worn by nobodies, but it has been worn by other types of entities on a number of occassions, MX was even seen wearing one in his debut of BBS to leave Ventus on DI in the dead of night. So the origins of the coat aren't quite known, nor are it's ability to sheild one from darkness or cut-off the scent of darkness and/or light coming from the vessel.​

Still, there are a few things things that might suggest he is a nobody. At the end of the special trailer he is seen accompanying 11 other members of the organization. Not counting Braig who shot arrows in the exact spots they appeared, and if I were to venture not Lea either. Another thing that may point this out, is his stance. One that has caused numerous speculations. One blade going straight up, the other going straight left, to equate his weapons like the hands of a clock, one is on the 12 the other is pointing to the 3.​

His stance symbolically informs us that he is the 15th member. Now as we all know (At least those who who've played through Days) Xion is No.14, and while she doesn't have her own throne (as pointed out by Saix), belong to the nobody species or even have her own grave site, she still is considered a member. Furthermore, Vexen in one of his reports queried if replicas couldn't be considered a form of special nobody. So one side says she isn't a nobody and another says she's a special nobody. Honestly, it may just be a matter of opinion rather than fact(After all, why would Numora have put it in there for absolutley no reason?).​

Attribute

Every nobody has an attribute, at least those who are humanoid. Xemnas was Nothingness, Xigbar was Space, Xaldin was Wind, etc. But what does MX's Nobody have for his attribute? Some might say it's Dreams, other might say it's Sleep. But, taking less into mind that they're in a dream therefore anything can happen and taking more mind into the following quote ...​

Nomura: As I just mentioned, the mysterious boy in the black cloak causes the story to take an unexpected turn. Whenever he appears, Xehanort and other characters that have been linked to him, like Ansem, seem to follow, even though they’ve already been defeated in the past.



It leads to the only obvious attribute that has yet to be used-up; Darkness. They're all linked to Darkness, if he had power over Dreams that would be very limited and rarely useful. Sleep, uh, doesn't Sleep have something to do with Darkness? Also, the fact he's trying to draw Riku and Sora to Darkness kinda complements the possibility. And say he does have the power of Darkness, so does Maleficent, and she has the power over Sleep as she explained in BBS.​


So if he has the power over Sleep, then what would he be able to do with that?

Nintendo Power: In a recent trailer, we spotted various Nobodies like Xemnas, Xion, and Axel. How is it that they’re around for the events of this game?
Nomura: I can’t discuss details just yet, but the mysterious boy in the black cloak has something to do with this. They will confuse Sora and Riku wherever they go.​


Thank you Numora, Nintendo Power, and KHInsider ^_^ Does it not make sense, how this would allow him the ability to bring them to the Realm of Sleep?


Master Xehanort

Now between now and since I accused MF of being Master Xehanort's nobody, you may have had this question in your head. "If you're right how is it that Master Xehanort is still around" or "If you're right how did Xehanort regain himself like Sora?" Both are good questions, and while they deserve good answers I'll respond to the 2nd by first presenting my own question.​

... ... ... Who said anything about him ever regaining himself? ... Yeah, I do believe he never regained himself, meaning I believe our dear Master Xehanort is in Fact a Heartless. I don't expect everyone, if not anyone to take this for face value, but instead I will back it all up.​

I'll start with how I came to this conclusion. Was it because MX had no disregard whatsoever towards Terra's feelings or Ventus when he surrounded him with a pack of Neo Shadows? Is it because just like Ansem SoD he was trying to corrupt Terra and Ventus during the course of BBS? Is it because he's so knowledgable towards darkness? Or is it his ability to control darkness so effortlessly?​

All I take into account in strengthening my theory, but one event or occurence trumps them all within my opinion. In BBS the first world Terra goes to is the world where Maleficent resides, rather Enchanted Dominion. There she seemingly possesses Terra to steal Princess Aurora's heart, after so she reveals to him he is the one who caused this to happen and that she merely tempted him using her power over Sleep. Later after his fight with Terra, Braig rementions this event(How he was lead to this opinion is something that we don't quite understand yet), where MX redirects him by saying "Darkness is made from strong light, and as long as that is present in a heart it's not possible for someone to steal another's heart" the scenario ends with Braig realizing that Terra couldn't have possibly done that and MX giving a smirk.​

Nowhere within the storyline is this explained, rather it was revealed in the BBS Ultima:​

-- If Terra wasn't the one who stole Aurora's heart in his chapter, who actually did steal it?
Nomura: It was Master Xehanort and Maleficent. In "KHI" it was shown that beings of darkness like Maleficent and the Heartless are able to steal people's hearts. The theory is that Terra, who has light residing in his heart, is not a being of darkness and therefore didn't steal Aurora's heart.​



Now that could just say the Maleficent and MX are just beings of darkness, or it could point towards Master Xehanort being a Humanoid Pureblood Heartless.



Mickey: But the world's made of light AND darknesss. Can't have one without the other, 'cause darkness is half of everything.​


^ That also makes me believe it probable. That and a few other things. In an early stage of Kingdom Hearts Numora said, "a Keyblade needs a base to form" And it was later revealed this didn't exclude darkness. Personally if it did, it would've been a plot hole as both Mickey's 2nd Keyblade and the KoPH are both forms of darkness. But moving on, there's been no exclusions for darkness to make this theory impossible. The Rite of Passage just needs for that individual to be acknowledged as master in some way by one who is already a master(It's the reason why Terra could perform it with Riku).

A being with a heart of pure darkness can weild a Keyblade, as Vanitas can wield one. As long as a person has a heart they can weild a Keyblade, can they not? So what has been stated that excludes a heartless from the equation? Absolutely nothing from what I've heard. Feel free to show me proof that there is.​



MF (Part 2)​



So to recap, I think MF is MX's Nobody. Now, Numora has revealed that Xemnas was 30 or so and that he was in possession of a heart just like Roxas. Terra's body was in or around it's 20s when taken by Xehanort. At least 11 years takes place between BBS and KH2. So, that explains why Xemnas appears older, not because of Xehanort, but because of the heart which allows the body/vessel to age. Which is how MX would be able to appear as he does, despite being a heartless.

This is relevant in the sense that for quite sometime people have said that MF is a Time Traveler. Numora said he can manipulate time, but that's not exactly saying he can time travel. If he has no heart, then countless years could pass and he would remain unchanged. Now the chronological time frame where he appears in LoD is between when Terra leaves for the Keyblade Graveyard to before everyone is there.​

So why was he there? Perhaps he was mourning the loss of his home? I know nobodies can't feel emotions, but they can use their memories to make it seem like they do, that's how they pull-off the ruse, or it could've been that he was being lost in the illusion of nostalgia. Either way, that point in time wouldn't really warrant him to test them, I'd think it would make much more sense if he was trying to destroy them because he didn't want to be seen. Now that could insinuate he really doesn't care of MX's plans and rather his own agenda.​

Or, maybe there's a reason why Aqua was the one fighting him within the trailer. Just some food for thought. But it does make sense that this guy could be MX's nobody. He froze Ventus solid, he raised part of a valley making it a very high plateau merely with a raise of his hand, and a number of things in his battle against Terra. Who knows what else he was capable of?​

That covers the magic part, now for the his physical capabilties. When he first gains Terra's body, you'd think he'd have some trouble using it, but to our surprise he's able to use it impressively right-off the bat with speed and power that Terra's never even shown even up to this point. As if they're bodies weren't all that different at that very stage of life at all, who knows? What's to say this wasn't an insinuation that Master Xehanort wasn't even more power and fast than he was with Terra's body? So that kinda clears-up why he so quick and powerful.​

However, from what we've seen in the fight against him, I think it's safe to say his manipulation over time is much more limited. I know it's impressive that he's even able to do that, but if he was fighting because he was spotted and could just turn back time why not do so to the point before he was even spotted? This is just one of that the things that leads me to question he's a time traveler. So has this guy been just sitting on the side-lines for 12 years? Ehhh, more like that for the RoL, he could have been in the RoD for that time, and then could make an appearance in BBS Volume II, but that remains to be seen.​

In Closure



These two quotes I think should also be taken into consideration:​

"You are one of many roads I may choose to take, trust me. I made sure of it."


"Xehanort's heart, once seized by his heartless half is now free. And his body, which had become his nobody has been vanquished. Both halfs will now be returned to the whole. In short, this means Master Xehanort will return."

^ Aside from the whole being Terra, with Master Xehanort acting as a plague. The Xehanort, YS was reffering to may have meant Xehanort being in control, which says he might know who Xehanort really is like we the 'players' do :/​

Before I give the breif summary, I know Numora said 'something' was left when Xehanort stabbed his heart(Not Master Xehanort), but how would that fit? Neither of their bodies and souls were taken and reused, and even if one of their's did, that just insinuates another Namine situation :/​



My theories are that MF is MX Xehanort's Nobody, He brought the Organization Members who were revived to the Realm of Sleep, His attribute is Darkness, MX is actually a Heartless, and MF is not a Time Traveler. Not exactly as believable to even me without the explainations, but that's the summary. Feel free to express your opinions on each or all of these theories. If you need me to explain some things, I'm more than happy to at least make an honest attempt at answering them ^_^ And with that, we shall hopefully see what is right and what is wrong at the release of KH3D.​

 

KingdomSoul333

Bronze Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
1,366
Location
Southern California
This is a very interesting theory and while nothing comes to mind that can contradict this theory at the moment, i really hope this isnt the case, there is already a lot of heartless/nobody confusion and the fact that AX has 3 hearts in the mix makes it even more complicated, i would prefer if nomura came up with something original when explaining who MF really is, but thats just my 2 cents.
 

Dawn Rebirth

New member
Joined
Sep 4, 2009
Messages
828
Location
Can you say vacay on Radiant Isle, and I'm growing
This is a very interesting theory and while nothing comes to mind that can contradict this theory at the moment, i really hope this isnt the case, there is already a lot of heartless/nobody confusion and the fact that AX has 3 hearts in the mix makes it even more complicated, i would prefer if nomura came up with something original when explaining who MF really is, but thats just my 2 cents.

I respect and understand your concerns, in an already complicated series anything that would make it even more so isn't warranted by anyone(Or at least that's what I would imagine). There should be a gray area between Simplicity and Complexity, sadly the scales tip towards the favor of complexity in the case of KH. Still, even though it is complex in it's own merit, things such as reports, certain scenes, and of course interviews with Nomura at least help to break it all down for us. I'd rather have that, than have no one or thing to explain whatever wasn't within the course of the game's storyline.
 

Hillboy

MIA
Joined
Aug 9, 2011
Messages
3,527
Awards
6
Location
New England
Thatvwas an amazing theory and you had me until MX being a heartless. But thats more my personal opinion then the facts that you gave. This is more thought out then any other thoery I've seen... we'll see I guess
 

Nayru's Love

Why don't you play in Hell?
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
4,232
Awards
9
Age
30
Location
Chicago, IL
So, MX could have produced a nobody prior to that event and thus that would be his nobody and therefore not Xehanort's, savvy? It's somewhat complicated, but it does make sense in KH universal rules. The fact that MX's nobody shares so many characteristics with Xemnas, even to the point of sharing the same type of weapon may indicate their connections as being in a sense the same person. In a way, one could say that MX's nobody is a younger version of Xemnas, and the opposite for vice-versa, but that's more interesting than significant.​

I'm all up for the possibility that MX created a Nobody at that moment. However, if MF is indeed that Nobody, he should be looking like MX instead of a young Xehanort.

Still, there are a few things things that might suggest he is a nobody. At the end of the special trailer he is seen accompanying 11 other members of the organization. Not counting Braig who shot arrows in the exact spots they appeared, and if I were to venture not Lea either.
Even to assume that the 11 other members are members of the Org. is still a big assumption.

Another thing that may point this out, is his stance. One that has caused numerous speculations. One blade going straight up, the other going straight left, to equate his weapons like the hands of a clock, one is on the 12 the other is pointing to the 3.[/CENTER]
MysteriousFigure.png


The blade isn't quite stright up; it looks more like 11:15.

Every nobody has an attribute, at least those who are humanoid. Xemnas was Nothingness, Xigbar was Space, Xaldin was Wind, etc. But what does MX's Nobody have for his attribute? Some might say it's Dreams, other might say it's Sleep. But, taking less into mind that they're in a dream therefore anything can happen and taking more mind into the following quote ...[/CENTER]




It leads to the only obvious attribute that has yet to be used-up; Darkness. They're all linked to Darkness, if he had power over Dreams that would be very limited and rarely useful. Sleep, uh, doesn't Sleep have something to do with Darkness? Also, the fact he's trying to draw Riku and Sora to Darkness kinda complements the possibility. And say he does have the power of Darkness, so does Maleficent, and she has the power over Sleep as she explained in BBS.


So if he has the power over Sleep, then what would he be able to do with that?​

Overall, the attributes of the Org. meant jack shit to the characters. They were more or less fancy titles, otherwise those "Luxord=MF" theories would've had some backbone.

MF's ability to summon people of darkness is more than that.

[
]Now that could just say the Maleficent and MX are just beings of darkness, or it could point towards Master Xehanort being a Humanoid Pureblood Heartless.

I'd go with the former.

^ That also makes me believe it probable. That and a few other things. In an early stage of Kingdom Hearts Numora said, "a Keyblade needs a base to form" And it was later revealed this didn't exclude darkness. Personally if it did, it would've been a plot hole as both Mickey's 2nd Keyblade and the KoPH are both forms of darkness. But moving on, there's been no exclusions for darkness to make this theory impossible. The Rite of Passage just needs for that individual to be acknowledged as master in some way by one who is already a master(It's the reason why Terra could perform it with Riku).

A being with a heart of pure darkness can weild a Keyblade, as Vanitas can wield one. As long as a person has a heart they can weild a Keyblade, can they not? So what has been stated that excludes a heartless from the equation? Absolutely nothing from what I've heard. Feel free to show me proof that there is.​
I don't quite see the point that makes MX being a Heartless more probable. :x
 

Vani

LOVEY DOVEY DOVEY
Joined
Dec 29, 2009
Messages
2,145
I like every part BUT the Organization one.

Like Naryu said, it's a big assumption to say that the 11 other hooded figures where Org. Members. They could've been clones or just part of an attack or something. Plus if he had his own agenda like you said later, why would he become a member of the Organization?

I really like the idea though that MX= Heartless and MF= Nobody.
Maybe the reason why MX drifted away from the others is because of this.
 

KingdomSoul333

Bronze Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
1,366
Location
Southern California
Well ansem sod looked significantly different from apprentice xehenort, his somebody. Dont you think that yen sid and eraqus would has noticed an appearance change of master xehenort, unless they met him when he was already a heartless, which could explain why his nobody is so young...
 

Dawn Rebirth

New member
Joined
Sep 4, 2009
Messages
828
Location
Can you say vacay on Radiant Isle, and I'm growing
I'm all up for the possibility that MX created a Nobody at that moment. However, if MF is indeed that Nobody, he should be looking like MX instead of a young Xehanort.


Even to assume that the 11 other members are members of the Org. is still a big assumption.


MysteriousFigure.png


The blade isn't quite stright up; it looks more like 11:15.



Overall, the attributes of the Org. meant jack shit to the characters. They were more or less fancy titles, otherwise those "Luxord=MF" theories would've had some backbone.

MF's ability to summon people of darkness is more than that.

[

I'd go with the former.


I don't quite see the point that makes MX being a Heartless more probable. :x

That theory states he became a nobody at a young age, and unlike Xehanort and Sora he didn't have a spare heart pass onto his nobody, thus his nobody would have no means of aging. Savvy?

Technically, I'm stating they could be their whole selves, also if not them then who do you suppose they are? Numora did say the nobodies would appear to confuse Sora and Riku. However, it was Nintendo Power that assumed they were nobodies and Numora didn't say otherwise. But as Numora stated previously they are in fact their whole selves. As to my recollection the Nintendo Power interview was released before Numora was asked about Axel calling himself Lea.

Um, I think it was wavering, could you actually hold that stance perfectly still until the time where he was allowed to move? I know I couldn't.

Not so true. They actually had a connection to some of the members if not all of them. The best way they were put was during the opening credits for Days "Organization XIII's leader. Through power over Nothing he seeks power over Everything" Basically it's telling us Xemnas feels so incomplete that he wants, if that makes sense. "Founding member. A brilliant scientist with dominion over Ice ... And a personality to match" Need I really say anything for this one? "Founding member. Tremendously strong, but surprisingly quiet - Stalwart as the Earth itself" Same answer as Vexen's. "Founding member. An intellectual with no room for feelings. He can create Illusions at will" Personally this one doesn't really go into Zexion as much as it could. While he appears to be an anti-social he showed a bit humor when Vexen arrived in CoM:RR Mode. Also, while Zexion has the emo punk hairstyle, and did in fact lose his parents as a child (As explained by Even to Ventus in BBS) he is at no point seen feeling bad for himself or having a 'why me' moment. Personally, it wouldn't surprise me if Numora chose this hairstyle just to warrant this idea only to show it couldn't be further from the truth. Illusions suit him best for the fact that everything you'd assume of him just by looking at him is just illusions made by your prejudgement. Zexion is probably Numora's way of saying 'don't judge a book by it's cover', speaking of which isn't Zexion's weapon not a book ;)? "2nd in command who longs for a heart he does not have. Only the Moon breaks his icy calm" In the fights against him he goes into a berserk mode, complementing that statement, even more so as before his fight in days he says, "Moon shine down!". "An assassin who puts his agenda first, and everything else on the back burner. Weilds Fire" ... L: "Prefers to kick back with his sitar, and leave the dirty work to the Water under his command" ^0^ "Life, to him, is just a game to be won ... And he has all the Time in the world to do it" xD "In the arc of his scythe, Flowers grow and all else perishes. His pretty face hides ugly motives" While his entire attribute are Flowers in general, the rose explains Marluxia the best(Also, aren't the petal he leaves behind not uncanny to a blood-red Rose's?) like Marluxia's face the rose when it comes out of it's bud is truly beautiful, however so captivated by it we seem to ignore the thorns surrounding the rose, until it's too late. Reality is painful, such as a thorn, representing Marluxia's arrogant and selfish nature. "Weilding sharp knives and a sharper tongue. Her Lightning strikes as quick as her temper" Hmm L: "A boy, newly aware of himself. His Light shines as bright and brief as the setting the sun" Jack sh*t, huh L:? I really don't mean to be an ass about it, but think I made the point I was going for.

So I coulda figured -_-"

The fact that there's no rule that can contridict it is what makes it probable. Nothing is impossible, but things can be improbable. But you have the right to believe what you will until the final word is said, that your unalienable right as a human being ;)

I like every part BUT the Organization one.

Like Naryu said, it's a big assumption to say that the 11 other hooded figures where Org. Members. They could've been clones or just part of an attack or something. Plus if he had his own agenda like you said later, why would he become a member of the Organization?

I really like the idea though that MX= Heartless and MF= Nobody.
Maybe the reason why MX drifted away from the others is because of this.

Xemnas was planning on taking KH for himself, since they're basically the same person in a sense what would make him, from what we've observered, any different as merely just using them to get what he wants?

Wouldn't surprise me L:
 

Dawn Rebirth

New member
Joined
Sep 4, 2009
Messages
828
Location
Can you say vacay on Radiant Isle, and I'm growing
Well ansem sod looked significantly different from apprentice xehenort, his somebody. Dont you think that yen sid and eraqus would has noticed an appearance change of master xehenort, unless they met him when he was already a heartless, which could explain why his nobody is so young...

I understand where you're coming from. However, Ansem SoD is a heartless, he has a heart so his body could very well age. But I fail to see what you mean by the 2nd half, could you please elaborate on the part having to do with YS and Eraqus, I feel uncomfortable giving an answer to a question I do not fully understand >.>
 

JustSnilloc

New member
Joined
Dec 25, 2011
Messages
840
Age
32
Location
USA
I can see it TC, however MX cannot be a heartless... A heartless cannot wield a keyblade. What heartless are is a heart drowned in darkness, consumed by it, commanded by it, etc. However MX could be a heart with a human PPS, ex: Sora, Riku (at points in the series) and Vanitas (for the entirety of his existence (that we know of))

A heart of Pure Darkness =/= a heartless heart, in fact! You'd find that most heartless have hearts that aren't pure darkness, they are just drowned in the darkness, Make Since? Good.

Back to what I said, Heartless cannot wield a keyblade I believe this is confirmed somewhere... Nomura said it "basically takes a heart" (I'm paraphrasing) to wield a keyblade, and heartless don't have possession of their hearts (nor connections to other's hearts) so I'm assuming that's why they can't wield one

---

As far as the time-travel vs time powers idea goes, I've always wondered about that, it definitively holds some water

The theory as a whole though seems to work, however your quote from Yen Sid is troubling... The MF was never defeated so if that is indeed MX's nobody, then Yen Sid doesn't know what he's talking about... On the other hand Yen Sid could very well think that ASoD and Xemnas are Master Xehanort's Heartless and Nobody (respectively) which would mean still that Yen Sid is ill informed

Overall I like it though... the above is my rough combing through of the theory, I've thought along the same lines however you presented this thought in a nice way (albeit long, but nice nonetheless) ;)
 
Joined
Sep 19, 2011
Messages
2,239
Awards
3
Age
27
Location
In the great wide somewhere~
Very interesting theory here. :d Well researched and supported and it makes a lot of since when you think about it.

That said, there are some parts I'm not sure I agree on. The other replica was mentioned, for one, which I'm pretty sure was Repliku. That barely has any pertaining to the theory as a whole, though. The big the that I don't really agree on is him being there will 11 other members. Aside from that, I'd say I agree. ;3
 

KingdomSoul333

Bronze Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
1,366
Location
Southern California
I understand where you're coming from. However, Ansem SoD is a heartless, he has a heart so his body could very well age. But I fail to see what you mean by the 2nd half, could you please elaborate on the part having to do with YS and Eraqus, I feel uncomfortable giving an answer to a question I do not fully understand >.>

I am saying that wouldnt yensid and eraqus notice if mx became a heartless, would his appearence change?

And the second part was a rant, that basically says mx became a heartless before eraqus and yensid knew him and this is why they didnt notice a change of appearence, also this could perhaps explain why his nobody would be so young. Because it happened even before eraqus knew him.
 

Dawn Rebirth

New member
Joined
Sep 4, 2009
Messages
828
Location
Can you say vacay on Radiant Isle, and I'm growing
I can see it TC, however MX cannot be a heartless... A heartless cannot wield a keyblade. What heartless are is a heart drowned in darkness, consumed by it, commanded by it, etc. However MX could be a heart with a human PPS, ex: Sora, Riku (at points in the series) and Vanitas (for the entirety of his existence (that we know of))

A heart of Pure Darkness =/= a heartless heart, in fact! You'd find that most heartless have hearts that aren't pure darkness, they are just drowned in the darkness, Make Since? Good.

Back to what I said, Heartless cannot wield a keyblade I believe this is confirmed somewhere... Nomura said it "basically takes a heart" (I'm paraphrasing) to wield a keyblade, and heartless don't have possession of their hearts (nor connections to other's hearts) so I'm assuming that's why they can't wield one

---

As far as the time-travel vs time powers idea goes, I've always wondered about that, it definitively holds some water

The theory as a whole though seems to work, however your quote from Yen Sid is troubling... The MF was never defeated so if that is indeed MX's nobody, then Yen Sid doesn't know what he's talking about... On the other hand Yen Sid could very well think that ASoD and Xemnas are Master Xehanort's Heartless and Nobody (respectively) which would mean still that Yen Sid is ill informed

Overall I like it though... the above is my rough combing through of the theory, I've thought along the same lines however you presented this thought in a nice way (albeit long, but nice nonetheless) ;)

All that's needed for someone or something to weild a Keyblade is a heart (Which is supposably the reason why Roxas can weild one, although I've heard it's because he's Sora's nobody, more than anything). Is it so unbelievable that MX could be like SoD, who while like MX commanded the heartless?

Regardless, Heartless and Beings of Darkness can steal hearts and MX and Maleficent are the ones who stole Aurora's heart as explained the Ultima Quote that was provided.

If a heartless is made from the darkness of a heart, and if you slay a emblem heartless with a Keyblade, then why does a heart come out if it is not in possession of it.

One thing I am sure of is that they are entirely devoid of emotion.

Xehanort named heartless what they were because he was convinced they didn't have a heart, because they lacked the ability to express emotions. But, Days and KH2 should have cleared-up that they do have hearts.

--

While that could be concerning, YS seems to get all his information from the stars (It's how he found out about Eraqus being struck down and Xehanort n' Terra being the ones responsible). Everything he learns from them seem accurate from what I can tell >.>

Thank you for the complements, this is the best reception I've ever recieved withany of these theory thread :)

Very interesting theory here. :d Well researched and supported and it makes a lot of since when you think about it.

That said, there are some parts I'm not sure I agree on. The other replica was mentioned, for one, which I'm pretty sure was Repliku. That barely has any pertaining to the theory as a whole, though. The big the that I don't really agree on is him being there will 11 other members. Aside from that, I'd say I agree. ;3

The replica that was mentioned was after Repliku's destruction,
Day 171: The No. i Project

Xion failed to complete its mission. If this continues, destroying it and using the next Replica as the Duplicate would undoubtedly yield a higher-grade copy. No. i was among the initial lot, which naturally raises questions about its capabilities. At present, it is nothing short of broken. I cannot fathom why Xemnas would want to keep it.

But you are correct V_V

We'll just wait and see for ourselves ;)

I am saying that wouldnt yensid and eraqus notice if mx became a heartless, would his appearence change?

And the second part was a rant, that basically says mx became a heartless before eraqus and yensid knew him and this is why they didnt notice a change of appearence, also this could perhaps explain why his nobody would be so young. Because it happened even before eraqus knew him.

Considering the time lapse between Xehanort's last physical appearance in BBS and Ansem SoD's first in KH1 it's hard to say :/

Yes, my theory states that the reason he looks that way is because he became a heartless at a young age, rather than later on. Which is why his nobody appears so youthful.
 

JustSnilloc

New member
Joined
Dec 25, 2011
Messages
840
Age
32
Location
USA
Is it so unbelievable that MX could be like SoD, who while like MX commanded the heartless?

Yes, because heartless are incapable of using their hearts to wield the keyblade

Regardless, Heartless and Beings of Darkness can steal hearts and MX and Maleficent are the ones who stole Aurora's heart as explained the Ultima Quote that was provided.

The thing is here, that a Keyblade Master can also do crazy things with a heart (since keyblades are all about hearts)

If a heartless is made from the darkness of a heart, and if you slay a emblem heartless with a Keyblade, then why does a heart come out if it is not in possession of it.

Think of it this way, your heart has fallen into darkness and you have become a heartless... Well the darkness has wrapped itself around your heart consuming it, commanding it, your heart no longer belongs to you, it belongs to the darkness which has consumed it... When you see a heart flying out of a heartless it's because you have freed that heart of the darkness consuming it
 

Dawn Rebirth

New member
Joined
Sep 4, 2009
Messages
828
Location
Can you say vacay on Radiant Isle, and I'm growing
Yes, because heartless are incapable of using their hearts to wield the keyblade



The thing is here, that a Keyblade Master can also do crazy things with a heart (since keyblades are all about hearts)



Think of it this way, your heart has fallen into darkness and you have become a heartless... Well the darkness has wrapped itself around your heart consuming it, commanding it, your heart no longer belongs to you, it belongs to the darkness which has consumed it... When you see a heart flying out of a heartless it's because you have freed that heart of the darkness consuming it

The Rite of Passage seems to have been used less n' less, another thing is judging by what Sora went through a heartless begins to lose their memories, or rather forget them.

Sora: I was lost in the darkness. I couldn't find my way. As i stumbled through the dark, I started forgetting things - my friends, who I was.

Yet, this didn't happen to Xehanort.

Ansem Report 12
I have transcended to an existence of only the heart. I should have come back as a Heartless, but there is no sign of such a transformation.
My body has surely perished. However, I am different from the other Heartless, keeping the memories of before, and I have not taken on the form of a Heartless.
Did Xehanort lose himself? Just like MX he sought KH, perhaps for a different reason, but are we to believe he was corrupted by darkness? Also, if he held onto his human appearance because of a tremendous will just like the humanoid nobody brethern, how much different would MX be? Can will be strengthened over time? We know a lot enough about heartless, but XH we know only so little.

Okay, stealing a person's heart with a Keyblade by a master? Maybe if they were a being of darkness when doing so ... But the Vanitas' birth if that's what you're basing this off of, it looks like something done as a form of exorcism. Aside from MX, Keyblade Master's going corrupted seems like something that doesn't happen on a regular basis. Now is that to say there isn't another like MX? No, otherwise the series would be over after the Xehanort Saga, but it doesn't seem to happen on a regular basis, the Keyblade War could tie-in here, but that's just an baseless assumption at this point.

Okay you get a point there, but does this neccesarily tie-in with a humanoid heartless? They seem to be able to control all other heartless, but this could just be the case of 'the heartless allie with the strong'. Still, it seems odd that YS would mention XH being the only one out of the two (The other being Xemnas) to command the heartless. Could Xemnas not have done the same? He's higher up the food chain than Saix, who we knew that could command them.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top